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Peter will say that Johan Coetzee has got seven houses in Pretoria and Jo'burg, and you always see Johan Coetzee covering up in a very stupid way for Williamson with dates and stories and exactly vice versa, always. That's about it. So you will actually be involved, you are trying to enter a clique which is...which can only with pressure, enough pressure and the nerves will break. As happened: it took seven years for my stories to come out. I mean they made me a complete lunatic: "Okay, just listen to this madman's stories!" And today, what do they say? And at the time when I left the country I said: "One day..." and in the Harms Commission too you can read, I said... No it's good because the judge said to me in the Harms Commission: "How must I believe this crap you're talking?" He says 'crap'. And I says: "Now okay, Judge, one day if the truth comes out, you'll see this will be the truth. And someone will stand up in future. The truth is going to come out." And it did.come out and I can only hope that the Olof Palme sort of ghost will not be laid to rest but in the end will come out. And I unfortunately work very close with newspapers because out of my experience as I said I believe the pen is mightier than the sword, there's no end, I mean we are bogged down in our...all legal systems in the world with strict rules that you must abide by. And with that the truth will never come out.

Ö:

And they make also sort of security for you. I mean the journalists.

C: Yeah, yeah. You can do what I did. You can do it in two ways: either change

your hair, colour your hair grow a moustache and change your name or be open. The best way of defence is attack, attack: keep them on their back foot, keep them on the back foot. I mean Daisy Farm, when that was now exposed because apparently Boris Ersson went back and he never...never blew the

story to the Swedish TV. That's what the journalist says. But when the 23mFinnish guy sawon a Friday afternoon, two

o'clock, and spoke about this; he was visibly shaking, so there's a lot of skeletons that still will have to come out about the South African part. Not that I say 'must', it's not my decision, but the government has decided it, the Truth Commission has decided it, and that's why I go for it. I'm not allowed to speak to the media according to the rules of the Agency, but I said: "This fight that I've started, started long before I joined the Agency, that's why I work with the media."

Ö:

Okay. Well, then we have finished and the interrogation is concluded at 11.20. After the interrogation Mr Coetzee will give us some telephone

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