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K: No, no he did not, except that he was a former intelligence officer and also a Swedish intelligence officer. I had no other indication of what the man is even doing in Turkey now. You know, I don't suppose you just sit in Turkey for the rest of your life. I suppose you must be doing something, but I didn't ask him that. I didn't ask him to what line of service he is now or if he is running a business or whatever.

Ö: Can you give us more information about the kind of name, I mean if you can say if it's typical British or Italian,

K: No, it was definitely a Scandinavian. I won't say Swedish, but it's definitely Scandinavian. For the purpose, you must please take it; 1 am not joking, there are many of your surnames, which is quite unpronouncable to us. I think you have the same problem with some of ours. But it was not a difficult Swedish name. It was not a difficult Swedish name. It was something that I would be able to pronounce, but I do not make a connection with this Widén.D: Could it have beenK: I don't want to speculate. I am going to do a summary of this survice if I speculate. I would really, I can not tell you since I was in might the statement I've wrapped my brain and even before because I was going to make a statement, so that I could provide and get it on record in court, for the purpose of court. There is no doubt, now thathas intimate knowledge of this information and of the operations in South Africa. Look, I've been in this line of work since 1978. You usually have a shelf life of four to five years. I lasted until 1993, just before certain gentlemen end decided otherwise and put a stop to it, a good think I think also. You threw discussion on a lot of questioning I've done, soft interrogation, hard interrogation. I've talked to a lot of people. There was no stress with when he was talking to me. It came easy, it came as I would say, you know, well, can you remember either that man we caught for murder in springs in 1969, oh yes, it's so and so. There was no hesitation, there was no blank, there was no search of memory, not at all. And I am quite prepared at any stage to havethere, attached to a polygraph machine and also here attached to a polygraph machine. You could ask us the same questions. I would act ally prefere it. And use a voice (unstresser?) at the same time. Because I know that I am not going to lose. He is the one that is going to lose out. He knows .. I am not doing this to make things, you know, difficult for him. I am going to be trying to solve the matter here and that's it.

D: May I ask you like this, although I think that you have answered the question already in a way. Can you think of any means that would makecome forward and tell us what you have told us?

K: Say yes, and strangely enough I also toldthis although he did not seem to take it in. I said to him, that; ifis charged