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because it wasn't casy, and it wasn't

easy with the military power that existed at the time and with the connections that existed for private companies operating in the import lind export sector of armaments, establish the exercise of guardianship, an effort thut he made and that asserted me be doing ».

Asked, given the fact that, having also served as Defense Minister, could clarify the Commission on the arms loading circuit, in particular to Iran Iraq, when the international embargo was taking place, he replied:

  • Today, the investigative leads will be faced with the disappearance of all materiality - and when I say "disappearance of all materiality" I mean "Documentary materialily” - and, part of these operations, perhaps, would not even have coverage documentary on how the bill of lading needed to untangle a ship in a pori could exist. But, if we had had the ability to investigate the bill of lading that would exist in the clearance of goods transport vessels in the port of Setúbal and in the port of Lisbon, perhaps we would have documentation that would provide us with clues on this matter. Whan I can say is that in some of the trucks, which I learned about by accessing other processes criminal cases, criminal cases that tried to break through the urms embargo, the armament (clandestine cargo) that would be exported in the bill of lading, was normally identified as agricultural material and agricultural material was not subject to any restrictions on the bill of lading and landing. The transport roule, that is still used today - I repeat, Messrs. Deputics, still used today, this is the information that, obviously, throughout my life, I've been trying to recognize and understand -, remains Lebanon. Syria continues to be supplied through Lebanon and, therefore, with the civil war in Syria - at the momeni, with all embargoes-, continues to have traffic clandestine armament for both belligerents. I repeat, "for both belligerents", and this is also very complicated, because the supply of equipment to one side of belligerents is also done, perhaps, under cover of undercover operations from different nations, and we are already talking not about services within the scope of a NATO burt of specific services that started to have individual and political objectives autonomous. And it is not by chance that today we discover that France itself is taking the initiative to trigger a military operation autonomously, with its own services and capabilities. My conviction is that, under cover of Portuguese exporis, it was clandestine military equipment was dispatched to Lebanon und then Syrian forces, who were active in Lehunon at the time, would have brought armament to their respective belligerents!

Asked to clarify whether, when talking about illegal shipment, shipments went through Lisbon and Setúbal, were only made of Portuguese material (the war surplus, as you mentioned) or if the our ports also served to transfer other equipment or other materials military with other origins and that went together in the same cargo and if there was any news of this type of international arms traffic operations with other origins, replied:

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« I can only mention conjeciures, because othersise, perhaps, I wouldn'r be alive either. IS